Jiggmin's Village

@bazooka & @Magniloquent I just want to straight up say this isn't an attack and I just want you guys to elaborate more on this; https://i.imgur.com/fOyxKFr.png ? The only reason why I tagged you magniloquent is because it seem you agreed with your alt "Fallen" but if it isn't you then ignored the tagged. 

Firstly I want to say is that I agree with you @bazooka with your statement that just because you're high in the game doesn't mean you're skilled but you don't know shit about me or @AlphaZ so keep your false claim to yourself instead of claiming you know everything about us. 

I am sure that @AlphaZ doesn't care about your opinion or even want to write back but as for me, there's countless videos on YouTube from when I was rank 50's to upper 70's that I trapped with the best players in the game. 

I'm not the proest of being a trapper but I can hold my own & I can say that I do make pretty good standard trap maps for the community can try. 

I've entered one of the Trapper (<- discord) contest and I defeated one of the most amazing trapper that I've seen (@__) & it might have been a fluke but a win is a win. 

Yes I am saying trapping is one of many thing you can be skilled for PR2

I'm good at campaign battles & racing on newest

I've said this more than once, I never really cared about being the highest in the game.. The fact that I am is because I'm dedicated to do something that I loved back when I had depression and wanted to escaped my mindset. 

I agreed that macroing isn't skillful at all but mind you that this was a rule that you can get banned.

We had many years that players had to manually sim & physically be on the computer to go up the ladder. I don't think you quite know how easy for people to sim for 30 min and get hella bored so quick because it isn't for them but for those who found ways to do it for long hours throughout the day and not go insane that in my opinion is a skilled.   

Anyways, I might get hate for this post but honestly I don't give a **** just giving my 2 cent on what you said on the PR2 main chat ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


On the comment below, please let's not attack each other and have a civil debate about this. 

I made this to give my opinion since I couldn't give mine in the PR2 main chat cause they were offline.

I disagree.

the virginity in this thread is strong

I mean even with macroing I would say that rank correlates with skill (i.e. higher rank means likely to be higher skill). A lot of people macro with their own accounts that they got decently high before doing that, some before artifact gave out loads of exp. It's obviously not a "higher rank = higher skill" in every case but I feel "higher rank = less skill" is wrong in more cases than the former

I think the 2 biggest arguments you could really make are
- "You used someone else's accounts to macro" which makes judgement of skill unknown rather than bad
- "If I 1v1'd you right now I'd win and I'm lower rank" which depends on type of level but also rustiness which can be de-rusted rather quickly in most cases

The line about "You don't have to have any skill to reach rank 80" is true but in the most technical theoretical way, you could macro as your 1st thing, making 4 rank 0 accounts but this is a very unlikely scenario and the person would be known as specifically the person who did this. "Ranks have 0 meaning" isn't true either. In the gameplay sense I mean you get 1 stat point, and in the community sense most people who are high rank currently that I know are pretty good at the game

This pretty much boils down to theory vs statistics, where theory says there is no need to be a correlation but observed statistics says otherwise

I am moving this thread from Discussion Hall to Blogs. The reason for this is that the original post is mostly centered around personal opinions and backstories along with questions and responses to certain individuals rather than it being focused on a discussion of whether those who sim/macro do or don't have skill. If you have questions about it, feel free to PM me @Colind.

(21st May 2022, 7:31 PM)Camer the Dragon Wrote: [ -> ]in the community sense most people who are high rank currently that I know are pretty good at the game

That's simply because they've been playing for a long time.

Spent lots of time on PR2 = lots of EXP earned = high rank
Similarly,
Spent lots of time on PR2 = lots of experience and knowledge of PR2 mechanics = high skill

As time goes on, people who play more will naturally become very high ranked and very good at the game. And those who don't play as often will fall behind in both.

Heyo Colind, here are my honest thoughts, not just on what Bazooka wrote but also my deeper perspective. 

Personally, I have always found it ridiculous and very ironic that the highest ranked players in PR2 have always been those who hardly play the game itself, whereas, in any competitive game, you'd expect the highest ranked players to represent the top echelon of skill. And this does genuinely frustrate me, and others, on some level. I have always wanted the players such as myself who have continually pushed the limits of PR2's physics to receive the greatest recognition from the community-- but instead that recognition often went to who holds the highest ranks.

This disconnect (rank /= skill) is pretty accurately represented by you and AlphaZ, as Bazooka hinted at. There is no traditional skill required to reach the top ranks. In fact, every moment you actually play the game, a necessity to improve your mechanical skill and knowledge of techniques & strategies, you lose out on valuable exp. Then again, a minimum amount of stat points are required to perform advanced techniques & strategies. So, as a metric of skill, rank is mostly meaningless but should slightly correlate (as Camer mentioned, and I mostly agree). 


Thinking about all of this, the whole thing is very very silly. There's so much more to PR2 than your skill level. PR2 is a beautiful diverse game that we as a community enjoy in many different ways-- whether casual fun, social interaction, level creation, advanced modes like traps and frusts, or gaining rank via simming/macroing. 

I'd guess this is about more than the rank /= skill debate. I see how it would feel awful to dedicate several years to a game you love, accomplish something meaningful to you, and then be insulted and degraded for it. You, Colind, and AlphaZ too, absolutely deserve recognition, since what you've accomplished has taken massive amounts of time & effort that I know was driven by your love for PR2.
 

(21st May 2022, 10:58 PM)Master Raiden Wrote: [ -> ]That's simply because they've been playing for a long time.

Spent lots of time on PR2 = lots of EXP earned = high rank
Similarly,
Spent lots of time on PR2 = lots of experience and knowledge of PR2 mechanics = high skill

As time goes on, people who play more will naturally become very high ranked and very good at the game. And those who don't play as often will fall behind in both.

Yeah exactly

(21st May 2022, 2:13 PM)ThePizzaEater1000 Wrote: [ -> ]I disagree.

Care to tell us why?

(22nd May 2022, 11:58 AM)Different Wrote: [ -> ]Care to tell us why?

No.

Literally only just reading this now, fortunately during the time my life changed dramatically. Sorry this was aimed at me & you’re only just getting a reply back now, but I’m not going to explain what I said word by word. It’s true you can’t deny it, anyone with the understanding of how macroing works could set the programme up & leave it for 5/10 years to achieve max rank, the fact I mentioned this was demonstrated by the only 2 rank 80s goss purely off the fact that I’ve never seen either of you genuinely race on campaign or even anywhere on pr2. I’ve been playing for 10 plus years so the fact I’ve never seen you race, is saying something to me.. so I go off the assumption that you don’t actually race.