F@H: THE HARSH PR2 REALITY! 🤔👀

[Different]

+3 Rank Token
5,000 Points - Crown Hat
100,000 Points - Cowboy Hat

Let me take you all back in time in a galaxy far far away from today, which just happens to be over 14 years ago when F@H was FIRST introduced to the JV community. This was around the time when most of everybody were just kids in grade school. None of you guys had ever heard of F@H before, nor did you give a shit about it until Jiggmin began to introduce 2, really cool prizes.

Let me get something straight with you guys, upfront: Yes, the CROWN and COWBOY hats suck, nowadays. But back then??!... Oh boy! You Gen-Zs have no clue how insanely popular those two hats were back in the day because you were all too young to even remember. Even your very first, +3 rank was very special back then because if you were a smart player, you would wait until you reached rank 47 to use it so that you can get ahead in the game, very quickly. Back in 2009 you didn't have to worry about people taking advantage of folding you 1k because F@H was fairly new and they didn't know how to work the system, yet. Oh and FYI, a passkey doesn't protect you from getting folded.

So considering all this, you were around @bls1999 generation of kids who were probably in elementary school and wasn't aware of hardly any of this. Most of everybody who did remember, were Millennials like me. The roster back then was stacked and overpopulated by Millennials who were in High school and Middle school.

Man, if you had a crown hat, you were pretty much considered to be a high-class, ranking player from a special elite force. You were literally the man! Everybody wanted a crown hat because it was very special. With the crown hat, you were literally an invincible warrior crushing your opponents to death with supernatural powers making toy swords, guns, lasers, and mines look like a complete joke. You didn't really give a damn about how many people thought it was unfair to play with someone who had a crown hat because you had something that they didn't. You folded 5k to earn the right to separate yourself from everybody else who was stuck on 4 hats.

Now, if you had a cowboy hat, you were considered to be the top 5% of high-class, ranking players from a special elite force because you had supernatural powers to pretty much fly where ever you wanted to go!... Anywhere! You were like a pilot taking off whenever the 3 count was over with. Yes, it was highly unfair in campaign modes, but who gives a damn because you worked hard for that shit! 100k for this bad boy was an insane, stratospheric number back then. Which leads me to my second point...

...Nowadays, 5k & 100k for these two hats is essentially nothing, right? But back then, how many people do you know were complaining and begging people (who had those hats) to fold them all the time? 100k for a cowboy hat was nothing to sniff at, ladies and gentlemen. Even 5k for a crown hat was a lot, back then. I didn't get my first crown hat until 2011, then a cowboy hat in 2012. I didn't give a damn about F@H, nor did I ever have the money to invest into a pretty decent graphics card that would allow me to get these things.

I believe 100k for a cowboy hat back in 2009, for it's historical value, is probably worth 1,000 times more today which is worth 100,000,000 points, now. With crown, this was 5k at it's historical value back then, so 5,000,000 points today (never mind the epic stuff).

Now the graphics cards that everybody had back then, was very ABYSMAL because if I recall correctly, people were folding at least 100-1,000 PPD back then. Nowadays, people would laugh and shit on you for folding those minuscule numbers. But back then, everyone shared the same grind and passion to get the two most, baddest hats in the game. So, it was not a hysterical matter back then. People would overclock their CPUs just to speed the process up because for some people, it would take months to get a cowboy hat, which was very ABYSMAL! This is why most people would stop after obtaining the crown hat; that's a 95k difference between the crown and cowboy hats.

If you'll take a look at THIS list of graphics cards, you all might is well find yourselves at the very bottom of this list because that's what you guys all had, back then. What also sucked was the fact that we had to ask our parents to help us figure out this F@H stuff because it was a nightmare. You didn't have the money to invest in a better graphics card because A: You were a kid with no job back in grade school. B: A lot of those graphics cards probably didn't even exist back then, so you had to work with what you had, you feel me?

Let's assume that at least 300 people were playing back in 2009, right? I'd say about 5% of them had cowboy hats (the way I remember it), and about 15% of them had crown hats. Do you realize how appalling those numbers were back then? Think about it.

1,000 Points - +3 Rank Token
5,000 Points - Crown Hat
100,000 Points - Cowboy Hat
1,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
10,000,000 Points - +1 rank token

Fast forward 4+ years later, and early 2013 would be the birth of the +4 and +5 rank tokens on the higher end of the F@H scale. Around this time period, you'd have guys like Deathbygabe1, NixZiZ, Dylan Ray Dubuisson, and PrinceCharming who would already be far ahead of everyone else, having these 2 extra rank tokens. If I recall correctly, only those 4 guys had +5 at the birth of the rank tokens giving them the advantage well ahead of everyone else. I'd say less than 20 had a +4 because if you really think about it, people were done folding after 100k because there was no reason to keep folding back then, unless you were supporting Team Jiggmin.

The credit for these two tokens goes to @aaaaaa123456789 for the suggestion. Now let's dissect the amount of time it would take someone to reach these two, very special tokens back then. First off, 1m points for a +4 rank token used to be preposterous. I mean damn, how the hell am I going to sit there and have the discipline to fold 900k more??! You see nowadays, a +4 rank token is nothing because everyone has their fancy, graphics cards that deals out substantially high, PPD numbers in the millions. But back then, let's look at your graphics card, then tell me how long it would take for you to get a +4 rank token. The majority of people were folding much less than 100k back then, so the idea of folding 1m is preposterous in a nutshell.

Don't even get me started on a +5 rank token. 10m just to get there is not only preposterous, but very intimidating and time intensive to say the least. I can't even begin to tell you how very few people had the capabilities to even see a +5 rank token in their accounts back then. Let me say that again... very few people had the capabilities to even see a +5 rank token back then. The stretch from 1m-10m is an understatement. But the stretch from 100k-10m is far from an understatement. I don't think you people understand how big of a deal, a +5 rank token was back then. I didn't even see my first, +4 until Oct 2013... and my first, +5 until Jan 2016!

Guys like Deathbygabe1 was folding 500k PPD back then, which was nothing to him. As time went on, people began to invest into better graphics cards, eventually. So you could expect them to get between 150k-300k PPD, starting in 2014.

1,000 Points - +3 Rank Token
5,000 Points - Crown Hat
100,000 Points - Cowboy Hat
1,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
10,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
25,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
50,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
100,000,000 Points - +1 rank token

5 years later, @XeNo makes a suggestion that there should be 3 more EXTRA RANK TOKENS because the top folders have already reached their +5 goals, and since people were debating about having Team Jiggmin reach the top 100 goal, they had to incentivize people to fold by offering more prizes. After people were constantly debating about adding more prizes into the game for the last 2 years, @bls1999 decided to make it happen as part of a STIMULUS PACKAGE.

So now, let's analyze these 3 extra rank tokens, shall we. First off, if you're not used to folding a substantial amount of PPD, then you're going to think that 25m is preposterous because the gap between a +5 and +6 is extremely high. During COVID, you already knew that guys like Deathbygabe1, PrinceCharming, NixZiZ, & Dylan Ray Dubuisson would already have these rank tokens because their F@H scores were extremely high enough to last a good while. So, most of them got all the tokens before we ever did.

Around the COVID era, you can expect those who were hungry to get their ranks a lot higher than they are, to revisit THIS list of graphics cards, then save their money to buy GEFORCE RTX graphics cards because those were rewarding them with substantially high numbers in the millions. Now let's face it, those guys have never folded 1m points before in their lives, back then. What guys? - THESE guys, the top 3 highest ranks in the game. So really, 25m is still nothing to sniff at. The same thing can be said about 50m and 100m because it's far too time intensive for those who's graphics cards deal out less than 1m. Also, some people don't run their CPUs full time, which can also be a problem because it'll take you forever.

Then the bar gets stretched even higher than that, when you go to 50m, then 100m. Bottomline: the higher the bar gets stretched, the more you're overclocking your CPU running it hot, full time, to get to where you need to be, quickly. Nowadays, if you're one of those GEFORCE RTX graphics card owners who folds millions of PPD, then these numbers probably don't mean shit to you, now. But, back then, I'd imagine your first impressions were "oh shit, how the hell am I going to pull this one off? My graphics card can only do like 300-500k PPD, which is nothing compared to this!"

The higher you elevate your game and improve your materials, the less you'll care about anything under 1m because you're used to doing that. Some people are still humble today, but back then everybody was.

1 Point - +1 rank token
500 Points - +1 rank token
1,000 Points - +1 rank token
5,000 Points - Crown Hat
100,000 Points - Cowboy Hat
500,000 Points - Epic Crown Hat
1,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
5,000,000 Points - Epic Cowboy Hat
10,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
25,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
50,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
100,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
250,000,000 Points - Epic Artifact Hat
500,000,000 Points - +1 rank token
1,000,000,000 Points - +1 rank token

So now, here we are. Notice anything new? No? Well, let me point out to you that I've added 3 more suggestions towards the bottom of this list. Why? - Because there are a bunch of people who have busted their asses off for TEAM JIGGMIN to get past 250m. I think there should be an award for those people, especially reaching 1B F@H points. I understand that these people are trying to support Team Jiggmin and get them towards the Top 100 list, but unless those last 3 prizes are added in the game, you'll probably never see that anytime soon.

I think it's time THIS thread gets updated to my last, 3 suggestions because I know I'm not the only one who THINKS this way.

My advice: If you're looking to fold very quickly, then not only should you overclock your CPU and run F@H full time, you should also go out and invest your hard earned money into getting a GEFORCE RTX 4090. Yes, they're very expensive and can cost around 4k. But, if you ever get one of these, then you're looking to earn about 21m PPD. For those who would be freshly starting out, it would take you roughly 50 days just to reach 1B points! So yeah, I'd say it's worth the money in that sense.

FUN FACT: If Deathbygabe1 would have never stopped folding, and he invested in a GEFORCE RTX 4090, he'd probably be at 10B F@H points by now.

[EpicMidget]

I've said it before, but Team Jiggmin reaching Top 100 again is highly unrealistic. Team Jiggmin has been steadily losing ranks, and will eventually return to Top 150; no additional F@H incentives will change this. It's not a bad idea by any means, but this game already has problems with gatekeeping sets and hats. If this type of exclusivity and prestige was introduced to the game off rips there wouldn't be much of a problem. That isn't the case with PR2 though, and it was introduced late into the game's lifespan which is a product of poor game development and community management. So no, I don't think adding super-tiered F@H incentives benefits anybody but a few. The game should stay the way that it currently is with only QoL updates/bug fixes as the time for certain changes has already met their expiry, and implementing those changes would just be a big **** you to the people that advocated for them earlier.

I totally agree with your perspective on the added F@H tiers, but when it comes to updates to the game itself, I don't think the 'this should've been added a long time ago so it shouldn't be added now' attitude is the greatest. The game (or at least the game's concept) still has lots of room to grow so, why stop?

[EpicMidget]

Growth should be proportionate to the active player base. The value of catering to the 10 active players is not equivalent to or greater than preserving people's nostalgia/memories of what the game was. Rendering the game unrecognizable by spam-adding updates does not do anything. PR2 is 15 years old going on 16, and what's left of the game is a vocal minority insistent on changing the game. The active players haven't even been around since 08-09. People have had time to become full-grown adults with lives in the time it has taken for PR2 to age as much as it has. Wives, kids, and careers. It's hard to advocate for growth when the game is dead. Admittedly, arguing on a near-dead forum is unproductive as well, and people flexing their skills on a game way past its prime is by far the funniest thing I have seen. That's beside the point, as sad as that is.

I just find this to be a pessimistic attitude in general. The way you describe platform racing 2 makes it sound like it can only be appreciated as a piece of people's past, but I strongly believe that people should be allowed to enjoy the game however they want. I do agree that updates pushed out should not change the game to a point where it's unrecognizable, but I don't think that is ever their intention. The most heavily-requested updates are most likely the leaderboards and challenges of some kind (from what I've seen) which would not scare any players returning from the past for the nostalgia that they will still feel the exact same. 

I personally still see this game as a stepping stone towards a more accessible and polished version (re-make?) with the same physics and concept, so anything added here would not only be creating a more perfect (subjective but TRUE) pr2, but a test run for what is possible in the future. 

The moral of the story is, that if people want to enjoy the game and flex their skills, what gives you the right to judge them? Just let people be happy. Aren't you the highest-ranked player in the game too? lol

all love

[EpicMidget]

If growth always had to be proportionate to the active player base, and you shared that sentiment with every game or business, nobody would have achieved anything in this world!

[Delphinoid_]

Ignoring the suggestions, this thread is a bit ridiculous. The point of F@H rewards was always to raise awareness about the F@H project and encourage people to contribute to it. You say "people were done folding after 100k because there was no reason to keep folding back then"; I and many other people continued folding because we agreed with the project's cause. Some of us would fold for other people who wanted the extra hats (folding for others was a really big thing, and how most people got crowns and cowboy hats), while others just kept folding without worrying about that kind of thing. I don't think anyone (except maybe the younger players) considered people with crowns or cowboy hats to be "high-class" or "elite", my perception was more that people who had all the hats and parts had just "beaten the game" in some sense. I think the fact that most people could easily find someone who would be happy to fold a crown or cowboy hat for them kind of supports this.

Also, an error in the OP - rank tokens weren't originally a reward, originally you just received 3 extra ranks (not in token form) for folding 1,000 points. "Folding people" was never really an issue because only a small handful of people have ever cared about having a high rank. In the early days of the game, there was more of a focus on actually... playing the game... like racing, making levels, chatting, and so on. My perception is that the non-gameplay-related goals people seemed to care about (if any) were primarily collecting all the hats and parts.

To be honest, I think the absolute biggest feature that PR2 and PR3 were missing was allowing players to chat within the level editor. The social and user-generated-content aspects of the games were by far their biggest appeal, so it has always seemed a bit strange to me that these things were never quite married particularly well.

[~JBG~]

Ignoring the suggestions, this thread is a bit ridiculous. The point of F@H rewards was always to raise awareness about the F@H project and encourage people to contribute to it. You say "people were done folding after 100k because there was no reason to keep folding back then"; I and many other people continued folding because we agreed with the project's cause. Some of us would fold for other people who wanted the extra hats (folding for others was a really big thing, and how most people got crowns and cowboy hats), while others just kept folding without worrying about that kind of thing. I don't think anyone (except maybe the younger players) considered people with crowns or cowboy hats to be "high-class" or "elite", my perception was more that people who had all the hats and parts had just "beaten the game" in some sense. I think the fact that most people could easily find someone who would be happy to fold a crown or cowboy hat for them kind of supports this.

Yeah exactly, I remember loads of people also participated on FreeRice back when OG JV was up and running and as far as I can recall there never were any prizes for it.

[~JBG~]

Growth should be proportionate to the active player base. The value of catering to the 10 active players is not equivalent to or greater than preserving people's nostalgia/memories of what the game was. Rendering the game unrecognizable by spam-adding updates does not do anything. PR2 is 15 years old going on 16, and what's left of the game is a vocal minority insistent on changing the game. The active players haven't even been around since 08-09. People have had time to become full-grown adults with lives in the time it has taken for PR2 to age as much as it has. Wives, kids, and careers. It's hard to advocate for growth when the game is dead. Admittedly, arguing on a near-dead forum is unproductive as well, and people flexing their skills on a game way past its prime is by far the funniest thing I have seen. That's beside the point, as sad as that is.

In my experience the returning players logging on for a nostalgia trip have all been pleasantly surprised to see the game still receiving updates.
I don't see anything wrong with updating the game as long as it doesn't ruin any game physics and make older levels unplayable if it means the remaining active players get to enjoy the game for longer.

[Mia]

As long as there is an active community, then what is the harm in new updates? I think it is cool that my childhood game is still receiving updates, personally. Yeah, the community is smaller than it was over a decade ago, but there are still people around that appreciate the updates. It is nice to see that they still care about pushing updates to improve the game. I think that should be encouraged, no matter how big or small the player base is.

[~JBG~]

At what point is it enough though? How much longer does the game actually need updates? I don't think it does, and I don't find it reasonable to cater to 10 active players by spam-adding updates. PR2 is a finished product. Admittedly, the game has had some good updates, but some of those updates probably shouldn't have even happened. Again, I think that some updates that players have been suggesting are way past their expiry. How accurate and valuable would leaderboards actually be if only 10 players competed for the best times out of all the PR2 accounts created?

I think we should update it as long as there are players that still play it.

Why cater to the possible few that return for nostalgia and hate the changes and ignore the players that still love and play the game after all this time.

[Master Raiden]

The idea of adding more F@H prizes has already been raised before, and I don't really think it's a good idea.
See the FAH Prizes section of my comment here.

Most people do not have the ability nor the desire to fold a billion points. Those who do already have (or are close to doing so), so I don't really see the need to continually add prizes for the extreme outliers of Team Jiggmin.

As for PR2 updates, many of them like the level leaderboard would have been nice if they were implemented 14+ years ago, but it doesn't really make much sense to add it now since hardly anyone plays. I think small changes that improve the solo gameplay experience should be added though.

While it's important to not change PR2 too much, I think we should also consider who we are catering for.
Making no updates would be preserving nostalgia for all the people who care so little about PR2 that they haven't logged in in 5-10 years whereas making changes caters to the few people who actually care enough to log in a few times each week. People who care about PR2 should be prioritized above those who have pretty much forgotten it exists.

Most people who return to PR2 normally play for 30 minutes then never return again. And those who stick around normally play for a few months before disappearing for years. Shelving all the ideas from active players to cater for people like that doesn't make much sense, in my opinion.

[Different]

Ignoring the suggestions, this thread is a bit ridiculous. The point of F@H rewards was always to raise awareness about the F@H project and encourage people to contribute to it. You say "people were done folding after 100k because there was no reason to keep folding back then"; I and many other people continued folding because we agreed with the project's cause. Some of us would fold for other people who wanted the extra hats (folding for others was a really big thing, and how most people got crowns and cowboy hats), while others just kept folding without worrying about that kind of thing.

Ok, let's back up for a minute... You said "I and many other people continued folding because we agreed with the project's cause." Then you went on to say "Some of us would fold for other people who wanted the extra hats (folding for others was a really big thing, and how most people got crowns and cowboy hats)." First off, I've never even heard of a Delphinoid in Pr2, the JV community, F@H, or even heard someone mention that you folded them before. Who are you?? You never introduced yourself when you first created an account on JV, 4 years ago, and even if you were a part of the community, you never told us about it. So change that "us" pronoun to "them", & get rid of that "I" pronoun because I don't believe a word you say about folding other people. I don't even think you were around back in 08-09.

Also, an error in the OP - rank tokens weren't originally a reward, originally you just received 3 extra ranks (not in token form) for folding 1,000 points. "Folding people" was never really an issue because only a small handful of people have ever cared about having a high rank. In the early days of the game, there was more of a focus on actually... playing the game... like racing, making levels, chatting, and so on. My perception is that the non-gameplay-related goals people seemed to care about (if any) were primarily collecting all the hats and parts.

So, you’re telling me that you were around during the early days of Pr2 (08-09) right? You were paying attention to how big the roster was, how many people had crowns and cowboy hats, and how many people were on the rank 50+ spectrum, right? I’m just asking you these questions because I’ve not heard mention of you being involved in the JV or PR2 community or anything back then. I was around back then, and I’ve never heard of you before. So, what was your username because you sure as hell don't have it on here?

Also, that’s not an error. I did that on purpose so that people would get used to calling the +3 ranks, tokens. I don’t want anyone to be confused with what “used to be”, vs “now”.

To be honest, I think the absolute biggest feature that PR2 and PR3 were missing was allowing players to chat within the level editor. The social and user-generated-content aspects of the games were by far their biggest appeal, so it has always seemed a bit strange to me that these things were never quite married particularly well.

This sounds like a great idea for people to discuss how they're going to draw and create levels. Sounds quite innovate.

[Different]

At what point is it enough though? How much longer does the game actually need updates? I don't think it does, and I don't find it reasonable to cater to 10 active players by spam-adding updates. PR2 is a finished product. Admittedly, the game has had some good updates, but some of those updates probably shouldn't have even happened. Again, I think that some updates that players have been suggesting are way past their expiry. How accurate and valuable would leaderboards actually be if only 10 players competed for the best times out of all the PR2 accounts created?

I couldn't agree more with you on this. I think the game has had way too many updates in the last, few short years of Pr2. Pr2 is basically on it's last, life line. If we ever do get new players in Pr2, they won't even notice, nor will they give a damn about these new updates because the game is way past its prime.

[~JBG~]

I couldn't agree more with you on this. I think the game has had way too many updates in the last, few short years of Pr2. Pr2 is basically on it's last, life line. If we ever do get new players in Pr2, they won't even notice, nor will they give a damn about these new updates because the game is way past its prime.

Lol what are you on about? You have literally been campaigning for massive updates to the game that would for sure go against this statement.

[Different]

Lol what are you on about? You have literally been campaigning for massive updates to the game that would for sure go against this statement.

I meant updates for bugs and glitches only. My bad.

[Master Raiden]

I meant updates for bugs and glitches only. My bad.

Random bugs that are annoying should get fixed, especially the ones that softlock the game.

Glitches will never change because bls1999 isn't going to touch the PR2 physics. Some people have raised bugs in the past that will never get fixed because it involves messing with the physics.

[Delphinoid_]

Yeah exactly, I remember loads of people also participated on FreeRice back when OG JV was up and running and as far as I can recall there never were any prizes for it.

Exactly! I totally forgot about FreeRice, that was huge.

Ok, let's back up for a minute... You said "I and many other people continued folding because we agreed with the project's cause." Then you went on to say "Some of us would fold for other people who wanted the extra hats (folding for others was a really big thing, and how most people got crowns and cowboy hats)." First off, I've never even heard of a Delphinoid in Pr2, the JV community, F@H, or even heard someone mention that you folded them before. Who are you?? You never introduced yourself when you first created an account on JV, 4 years ago, and even if you were a part of the community, you never told us about it. So change that "us" pronoun to "them", & get rid of that "I" pronoun because I don't believe a word you say about folding other people. I don't even think you were around back in 08-09.

So, you’re telling me that you were around during the early days of Pr2 (08-09) right? You were paying attention to how big the roster was, how many people had crowns and cowboy hats, and how many people were on the rank 50+ spectrum, right? I’m just asking you these questions because I’ve not heard mention of you being involved in the JV or PR2 community or anything back then. I was around back then, and I’ve never heard of you before. So, what was your username because you sure as hell don't have it on here?

Normally I wouldn't stoop to responding to the "who" meme, but in this case it has the potential to be super funny, as well as a nice learning experience for you.

To be clear, you're right, afaik there was no Delphinoid on PR2 or JV. I had a lot of accounts back then (I usually used alts for racing and making levels), but the one you might remember best is "Mr.Black.". I think if you ever opened the lobby chat or used the original forums there's maybe a chance you might remember me, since even saying I was "super active" on both for most of their lives is probably an understatement - I straight up no-lifed them!

I think I was probably most well-known for being one of the most active posters on JV Comics (my character was the black ghost / shadow thing with the top hat), and I also did the original design for the Gecko parts (you can see my username in the game's credits). You might also know my brother, "Tommy 8", who created the Jigg hat. Not only was I part of the community, but I think by all objective metrics I was an unusually active and well-known one, especially considering that I wasn't part of any of the cliques back then.

With that said, I don't remember anyone who went by the name of "Danger" or "Different" at any point in the community's life, and you're one of the only people on this website who claims to be an older user that I can say this about. Maybe you can see now why dismissing what someone is saying solely on the basis that they're supposedly a "nobody" is not a particularly helpful thing to do. For the record I don't doubt that you played back then, but I suspect that you were probably more a part of some clique that focused on simming rather than the broader "Jiggmin community", which I think would explain this distorted perception of the playerbase.

This sounds like a great idea for people to discuss how they're going to draw and create levels. Sounds quite innovate.

Thanks. As you probably noticed from what I said, I used to love chatting in PR2, but I also used to love making levels. It used to bother me that in order to make a level I had to leave the chat. The way I got around it was using an alt for making levels - "TheWindowGuy" was my main one - and then I could just have a separate window open with the chat.

[Different]

To be clear, you're right, afaik there was no Delphinoid on PR2 or JV. I had a lot of accounts back then (I usually used alts for racing and making levels), but the one you might remember best is "Mr.Black.". I think if you ever opened the lobby chat or used the original forums there's maybe a chance you might remember me, since even saying I was "super active" on both for most of their lives is probably an understatement - I straight up no-lifed them!

Now that you mentioned it, I do remember seeing a Mr.Black back then. I think it was rank 45 or something like that. But that rank was reached much later than 2009, which is besides the point. Yeah, "Mr.Black" definitely stands out the most to me.

I think I was probably most well-known for being one of the most active posters on JV Comics (my character was the black ghost  / shadow thing with the top hat), and I also did the original design for the Gecko parts (you can see my username in the game's credits). You might also know my brother, "Tommy  8", who created the Jigg hat. Not only was I part of the community, but I think by all objective metrics I was an unusually active and well-known one, especially considering that I wasn't part of any of the cliques back then.

Ahh yes, "Tommy 8" - another familiar name that I remember way back than. I didn't know you had quite the artistic ability. I guess you grew tired of pitching and designing new, artistic parts for a dead-end flash game that's way past its prime, now. On the other hand, if you were so well known, why didn't you mention that here, I might have picked up on who you were? I just felt like I was pulling teeth with you, earlier.

With that said, I don't remember anyone who went by the name of "Danger" or "Different" at any point in the community's life, and you're one of the only people on this website who claims to be an older user that I can say this about. Maybe you can see now why dismissing what someone is saying solely on the basis that they're supposedly a "nobody" is not a particularly helpful thing to do. For the record I don't doubt that you played back then, but I suspect that you were probably more a part of some clique that focused on simming rather than the broader "Jiggmin community", which I think would explain this distorted perception of the playerbase.

Yeah, I can understand that. When I first joined the original JV, it wasn't until 2009. My original account, Danger, was first created around the very first start of the 2008, demo-release. Different is just a name that I call myself now, to distinguish myself amongst everyone else on JV2, here. It's also because I think differently and view life in a different way. My JV name wasn't the same as my Pr2 user identity because I wanted to remain anonymous. In fact, I think I named myself, Monster500 on the original JV, or something like that. I have some people that can botch for me that can tell you that I was definitely around, back then. Killer520 and Isaac is someone I used to rock with back in the day, that can tell you. Hell, I remember the clam project that UnknownAX did.

I only dismissed you as a "nobody" because you never revealed your identity during the beginning. At first, I thought you were some random, college graduate who spoke articulately and thought he was a know-it-all who's above everyone else. I apologize if I may have formed any misconceptions about who you were as a person. Even though I did pay attention the roster back then, I wasn't much of a "chatty" person. I chattered with a few people on JV and Pr2, but that's pretty much it. The real cliques were guys like quesin, Yellowfin, & Farticus Rex.

Thanks. As you probably noticed from what I said, I used to love chatting in PR2, but I also used to love making levels. It used to bother me that in order to make a level I had to leave the chat. The way I got around it was using an alt for making levels - "TheWindowGuy" was my main one - and then I could just have a separate window open with the chat.

Well, it's never too late to make a suggestion on JV2, and maybe Ben can get around to it or something.

[Delphinoid_]

Now that you mentioned it, I do remember seeing a Mr.Black back then. I think it was rank 45 or something like that. But that rank was reached much later than 2009, which is besides the point. Yeah, "Mr.Black" definitely stands out the most to me.

It was much lower than that, I was only rank 25 on that account. I was kind of autistic about ranking up on my main; I really liked the number 25 aesthetically and liked seeing it on my profile rofl. It was kind of stupid and I'm definitely in the minority for that.

Even though I continued to use PR2's chat, I kind of stopped racing and making levels when PR3's first "open beta" was released (even though PR3 didn't have the same charm as PR2, I loved the creative freedom it gave to level creators). I ended up returning to PR2 later when PR3 started to die though, and then as I began to get into TF2 in 2012 I started to quit PR2.

Ahh yes, "Tommy 8" - another familiar name that I remember way back than. I didn't know you had quite the artistic ability. I guess you grew tired of pitching and designing new, artistic parts for a dead-end flash game that's way past its prime, now.

The Gecko parts actually kind of started out as a meme suggestion, they were part of a joke "Goliathe4admin" campaign. I really loved TRUC's adorable gecko Goliathe and drew some parts based on him. The original design was pretty rough but I think the inspiration was clearer, especially from the eyes.

On the other hand, if you were so well known, why didn't you mention that here, I might have picked up on who you were? I just felt like I was pulling teeth with you, earlier.

I mean, I don't think being well-known really holds any weight... the only reason I mentioned it was because I thought it would be kind of funny, and as a means to an end to sort of demonstrate that when you started playing and so on doesn't really matter (since we clearly have different ideas despite both playing early on). I also don't necessarily like being associated with the "Mr.Black." moniker anymore, since I think I was kind of cringey back then (a lot more than I am now even), so I only use it for the character these days.

At first, I thought you were some random, college graduate who spoke articulately and thought he was a know-it-all who's above everyone else.

I still am LOL. I mean I guess it seems like I think I'm a "know-it-all who's above everyone else" because I like to argue a lot. I actually end up conceding in most of the arguments I have in other communities, but it doesn't really bother me so much. I just like to talk about interesting things with people, and I think it's also one of the best ways to really learn about new things and broaden your perspectives. I'm still trying to get better at arguing more genuinely and avoiding looking at arguments as a matter of "winning or losing" though - sometimes the way I argue is really stupid.

Well, it's never too late to make a suggestion on JV2, and maybe Ben can get around to it or something.

I don't really have any interest in JV2 except as an outlet for debating people, since there are people who use this forum who have some interesting opinions and ideas compared to my own.

[Camer the Dragon]

I find it a little surprising how F@H never decreased point rewards as GPUs/CPUs got better. You'd think every year they'd decrease point gain by 2x (or even something like 1.5x) either in one go or smeared out over the year, but they didn't which leads to loads of points now.
Main reasons I can think of for them not changing point rewards are:
- Less Effort to just keep it the same points
- Gets people to keep folding since points for teams matter more in the present than in the past (which is also a big reason Team Jiggmin has fallen behind I would assume)
Which is why I'm only a bit surprised and not very much so.